Why, not sure

But on June 27 2020 I took a screenshot of the debt clock

and six months later

I don’t even know which single item to highlight

to make things more interesting

The 2024 projection at current rates, think how fast the 2020 elections came and went, yes, 2024 is like tomorrow

and a look back, dates upper right, fewer columns as you go

so then where do I post this info…?

were you making any plans for the next four years?

prepping category it is


for reference

and for ???


We got a “We’re Fu@%ed” category?


Well, pick a favorite

This one looks ominous

GDP image

And, if you look, each state has its own, so, is that separate or included with national?


Here’s a big one

Since DC is not a state, is it the whole of the national debt?

If yes, can we just go into voluntary foreclosure/receivership and split that up between the creditors?


Scary to think about, but as a country we need to face it and get it under control.

I remember when the Cold War ended there was talk about the so-called “peace dividend” we were supposed to enjoy. All the hundreds of billions of dollars we were supposed to save annually from military spending. Some of that savings was supposed to go into infrastructure investments. As we all know, that never happened, and 30 years later our bridges are crumbling, delapidated roads and highways are clogged with traffic, public drinking water and sewer systems are old and heavily strained, etc.

Meanwhile, the so-called Covid relief bill has over $100 billion dollars in PPP loan forgiveness tax breaks for big companies who took advantage of them while my wife’s small business was denied a small PPP loan for the few employees she had.

I know I may be in the minority on this, but I don’t believe “trickle down” economic policy with its tax cuts for big businesses did much to help our long term fiscal situation, even with the tax rate staying relatively the same for the rest of American income earners. I’m not about high, progressive tax rates on the rich. I just think fair share tax rates coupled with targeted tax cuts on priority economic investment would’ve helped more. Keep the high progressive rates on American businesses that outsource and move manufacturing overseas, but give incentivized tax breaks to those that don’t.

As for Social Security and Medicare, we may just have to bite the unpopular bullet and raise the age limits on those, and I say this knowing I’m not too far away from qualifying under the current lower age limits. And then of course there’s SNAP, Section 8 and Medicaid. I don’t want to get rid of safety nets for the truly deserving, but entitlement spending needs to be addressed further. Same goes for corporate and big business subsidies, too (the so-called “corporate welfare”).

But how to do all that? I have no idea.


I disagree

That’s how, just what you started with. a great reply to an unpleasant reality


The Titanic has left the dock for the last time I’m afraid.


Yup. The socialists are about to take office and they think they can just print money and there’s no final accounting. Get ready for a collapse of the currency and everything that comes with it. Look at Venezuela for a clue.

They have been doing their best to destroy the middle class since it’s always been a thorn in their side. We just cant be controlled the same way poor folks can be. But now the once middle class is begging for a $600 check.

Next to get attacked will be firearms. They can’t have the rabble created by the socialists able to fight once they realize how screwed they are.

Of course I’m preaching to the choir. If the election was on the up and up, and I’m certain it was fraudulent, then the American people are so incredibly stupid! But as I wrote, I think it was fraudulent like we’ve never seen fraud before. I believe from what I’ve seen and read that the fraud was blatant and “right in your face” over the top.

Never give up your firearms no matter what they promise or threaten. If we do we’ve really lost our country. Time to get the gear ready and the firearms cleaned and oiled. If you haven’t yet, buy things you’ll need and don’t forget trade goods. When the economy collapses barter will still be done and you barter with items and not worthless paper.

edit: Another source of information re: what I think it will be like in the USA is to locate and read Selco Begovics’ writings on what happened in Yugoslavia. Sure, there are differences between us and them, but politically what we have in the US right now is oil and water, and once the dollar is worthless I think everything will break down. He has 2 books, the smaller one is basically excerpts of the larger, but he’s also online. A search engine will turn him up. Yes, he was a conscripted soldier. The sort of soldier where one day he was a civilian and the next had a gun with no training. He wasn’t really a soldier, just a person in uniform with a rifle.


As long as we have trees we will have money.


You think the paper debt instrument you use is valuable?

Guess which one of these four descriptions you’ve never used in your lifetime

The Four Different Types of Money

By Raphael Zeder | Updated Jun 26, 2020 (Published Sep 17, 2016)

In economics, money is defined as a generally accepted medium of exchange for goods and services. Virtually anything can be considered money, as long as it performs what we call the three major functions of money (i.e., medium of exchange, store of value, unit of account). With this in mind, it is not surprising that there were different types of money throughout history. To give you a brief overview, we are going to take a look at the four most relevant ones below: commodity money, fiat money, fiduciary money, and commercial bank money.

Commodity Money

Commodity money is the simplest and, most likely, the oldest type of money. It builds on scarce natural resources that act as a medium of exchange, store of value, and unit of account. Commodity money is closely related to (and originates from) a barter system, where goods and services are directly exchanged for other goods and services. Commodity money facilitates this process because it acts as a generally accepted medium of exchange. The critical thing to note about commodity money is that its value is defined by the intrinsic value of the commodity itself. In other words, the commodity itself becomes money. Examples of commodity money include gold coins, beads, shells, spices, etc.

Fiat Money

Fiat money gets its value from a government order (i.e., fiat). That means, the government declares fiat money to be legal tender, which requires all people and firms within the country to accept it as a means of payment. If they fail to do so, they may be fined or even put in prison. Unlike commodity money, fiat money is not backed by any physical commodity. By definition, its intrinsic value is significantly lower than its face value. Hence, the value of fiat money is derived from the relationship between supply and demand. Most modern economies are based on a fiat money system. Examples of fiat money include coins and bills.

Fiduciary Money

Fiduciary money depends for its value on the confidence that it will be generally accepted as a medium of exchange. Unlike fiat money, it is not declared legal tender by the government, which means people are not required by law to accept it as a means of payment. Instead, the issuer of fiduciary money promises to exchange it back for a commodity or fiat money if requested by the bearer. As long as people are confident that this promise will not be broken, they can use fiduciary money just like regular fiat or commodity money. Examples of fiduciary money include cheques, banknotes, or drafts.

Commercial Bank Money

Commercial bank money can be described as claims against financial institutions that can be used to purchase goods or services. It represents the portion of a currency that is made of debt generated by commercial banks. More specifically, commercial bank money is created through what we call fractional reserve banking. Fractional reserve banking describes a process where commercial banks give out loans worth more than the value of the actual currency they hold. At this point just note that in essence, commercial bank money is debt generated by commercial banks that can be exchanged for “real” money or to buy goods and services.


The folks in Weimar Germany pre WW2 had plenty of money too. Yes, they had trees to print plenty of it. And a wheelbarrow full of it was required to buy a few potatoes. People would get paid and leave for the day to spend it before what they were paid became worthless. So yes, money might exist, and be worth absolutely nothing more than the value of the paper it’s printed on.


Banks used to lend out 90% of the money they had. Now I’m pretty sure it’s more than that. Figure the big banks lend to the small banks, and they lend to people and companies, etc. if the apple cart gets upset, we’re toast. Buy gold and silver…and ammo.


Some I know said the stimulus check should be be cashed and sent to pay off the debt, thoughts? Haven’t read all above but we discussed some after church yesterday about the history of the debt


personally I’ve not taken any, this go around or past, and have my reasons

Did you discuss these things?


how would sending the money back help the debt…the debt is probably 5 times more than we are told…no stimulus would ever fix it…


It’s a way to protest and tell them what it should be spent on


No,but that reminds me it was called a bribe, those aren’t good


I have to completely disagree, sending it back would mean they will spend it as they please like always, it would be a protest they would laugh at…


I have to agree. Xtra funds would be shipped out to the inner city welfare rats we’re already paying to sit home & not contribute to society.
Spend it on ammo & firearms, or donate it to a worthy charity & write it off if you have too many guns/ammo already