HK yeah or nay!


#28

Failures with FN? Wow, okay? that’s new?..


#29

They do the same thing, the Bren is just $1.200 or so less and no Geissele trigger and other significant aftermarket available. A 16” barrel sucks though. 62gr fmj needs at least 18 to reliably do what it was designed to do (fragment). Otherwise you’ll only get ice pick effects on target, hardly desirable. 18” barrels for the SCAR are available.


#30

@Minuteman
Yeah I have had My FN new out of the box fail me. It was on the third magazine, 5th round. Safety on left side quite literally fell off on hit the floor. Model fn FNX. Caliber .45 acp, ammo I was using American eagle 240 grain. Common problem. It is in forums.

18 inch vs 16 inch barrel. The drop in velocity is an average of 80 fps with most loads. I in all honesty do not see that causing a problem with xm855 A1 or normal 62 grain ammunition with in normal distance engagements. I would rather take less weight and more maneuverability with a 16 inch. To be honest 300 yards in I want a 14.5 if I have the option. I also generally run 55 grain ammo due to better stability in flight. (Side note)The xm855 A1 flys a little wonky ( has a vibration during flight) due to the steel penetrator part not being on true center of the projectile. These are just my experiences with this stuff you may have had other experience.


#31

I dont care for FN pistols, they seem to have more issues then their rifles.


#32

Their hand guns are junk! I’d avoid them. FN is a machinegun and rifle company.

It’s not primarily about drop in muzzle velocity (exterior ballistics) but more of an effect on target issue (terminal ballistics). The 5.56 round was never designed to be fired from a short barrel and performs best from a 20 or 18" barrel. 55gr is only effective -as in doing whatit was designed to do- out to 100m. The threshold increases with 62gr. If you want to have excellent maneuverability while retaining optimal barrel length I suggest you go bullpup.

Israel Weapon Industries 18” Barrel X95 Tavor
Geissele Super Sabra Trigger Gen 2 w/ Geissele Super Sabra Lightning Bow Trigger
BCM Gunfighter Extractor Spring Upgrade Kit
Manticore Arms Luma Safety for X95/Tavor
Manticore Arms X95 Cantilever Forend
Manticore Arms X95/Tavor Gasketed Port Cover
Manticore X95 Curved Buttpad
Lantac Dragon DGN556B 1/2-28 UNEF R/H Muzzle Brake
Phase5 Mini Hand Stop M-Lok
Magpul 5-Slot Aluminum M-Lok Rail Section @ 3, 6 & 9
Magpul M-Lok Rail Covers Type 1 & Type 2
Magpul M-Lok QD Sling Mount
TangoDown SCAR P-Rail Panels 6”
TangoDown SCAR P-Rail Panels 2”
LaRue Tactical LT-FUG Forward Universal ‘Pillar’ Grip
Troy Industries Micro Set HK Front and Round Rear Tritium BLK Battle Sights w/ XS Sight Systems Troy CSAT Rear Aperture
Aimpoint Comp M4S w/ EOTech G33.STS 3x Magnifier
Surefire M600 Ultra Z68 Weapon Light – American Defense Manufacturing M600 PKG Mount Combination w/ AD-TacLever Upgrade @ 9
Savvy Sniper Quad X Cobra Sling
2x ALG Defense Forged Sling Swivel
Lancer Systems L5AWM Translucent Smoke 30-Round Magazines w/ 5.56 Magpul

Or if you want to retain AR-15 manual of arms go for a better caliber. There is no doubt that 6.8 SPC II is superior to 5.56 NATO in each and every way. It sure dodges the wind better. Beware though as 6.8 comes at a cost.

LWRC Six8 UCIW (or A5 / SPR if you prefer to avoid the NFA hassle and tax stamp)
LWRC Magpul 6.8 SPC Pmag 30-Round MAgazine
Surefire 68-5/8-24 Muzzle Brake
Geissele Super Tricon Trigger
Picatinny Rail Section @ 3/9
Primary Weapons Systems Enhanced Buffer Tube Mod 2
Geissele Maritime Bolt Catch
Battle Arms Development BAD CASS FA Ambidextrous Safety Selector – Standard & Short Levers
BCM Gunfighter Stock
BCM Gunfighter Charging Handle Mod 4
BCM Gunfighter Mod 3 Pistol Grip
Troy Industries Micro Set HK Front and Round Rear Tritium BLK Battle Sights w/ XS Sight Systems Troy CSAT Rear Aperture
LaRue Tactical LT-FUG Forward Universal ‘Pillar’ Grip
Aimpoint Comp M4S
Surefire M600 Ultra Z68 Weapon Light – American Defense Manufacturing M600 PKG Mount Combination w/ AD-TacLever Upgrade @ 3/9
Savvy Sniper Quad X Cobra Sling
2x ALG Defense Forged Sling Swivel w/ LWRC Hole Rail Section w/ QD Sling Mount Kit @ 3/9

Anyway, done right 62gr fmj certainly is accurate enough. The stability and accuracy of 62gr relates to the quality and consistency of the bullet design. IMI, Prvi Partizan, Black Hills, Hornady and Silver State Armory are the top brands.


#34

Every HK handgun (all were semiauto), I have looked at in person looked high quality, but the slide was stiff and the price was stiff (high!), too.

If you are looking for a handgun you can use that is more user friendly in the first 1,000 rounds, or so, I would not choose HK.

Glock, or S&W M&P, would work out better. Of course, it may be that the HK is the better gun in the long run, but you have to get there, first. And, some shooters don’t shoot their handguns that many rounds.

So, my vote is NAY on the HK handgun.


#35

Only one here. 91- $450 OTD in 1981 IIRC.
Who knew what they’d be now?
91%20rt


#36

The HK VP9 is a better shooter then Glock or the M&P, it is ready to rock&roll right from the box and has a better trigger ,grip(imo) and a paddle mag release all for the same price. HK has some of the best QC in the biz. The HK45compact has been my favorite HK pistol tat ive shot though, being a glock19 sized .45 it felt great in my hand. It was also built to go 25k minimum with no parts breakage and like the vp9 it required no break in.


#38

Thats because shotguns are obsolete, like muskets but less useful.


#40

jf89:

One of the advantages of a shotgun for personal defense is its limited range. I can’t think of any handguns or rifles that are so self limiting.

Think about that next time you are reviewing home defense scenarios.


#41

Im switching over to a wrist rocket with a handful of pellets.


#42

I wasnt around when those were still a thing, mail order is stone age shiz nit but I like the prices.


#43

That hurts to see on a deep level. I’m not a big HK fan, but I dont think anyone in here wouldnt grab a G3 for $400.


#44

Even though I know Minuteman is no longer a member here (which is rather disapointing). I wanted to point out that FN made one of the most famous combat pistols with the Hi Power. The pistol was literaly designed by not one but two legends in the small arms industry (started by John Moses Browning and finished by Dieudonné Saive).

Anyways, BUMP…and to get back on topic, The HK VP9 is hell of a pistol, same with the USP and HK45. The VP9 probably being my favorite at the moment.


#45

:+1:


#46

pffft VP9 - P8 is what you need, just missed getting one by minutes…


#47

A p8 is just the military version of the USP, right? Those pistols are the definition of overbuilt and pretty good shooters…but the VP9 is literally “the people’s pistol”.

“The Heckler & Koch VP9 is a polymer-framed semi-automatic striker-fired handgun. The VP stands for Volkspistole which translates to “people’s pistol”. The 9 stands for the caliber designation of 9mm.”


#48

https://www.heckler-koch.com/en/products/military/pistols/p8/p8/overview.html

P8 | Technical Data

P8 – CAL. 9 MM X 19

General
Calibre 9 mm x 19
Operating principle Recoil-operated with modified Browning locking system
Magazine capacity 15 rounds
Sights 3-dot
Dimensions
Length min./max. approx. 195 mm - 7.64"
Width approx. 38.5 mm - 1.26"
Height approx. 135.0 mm - 5.35"
Barrel length approx. 108 mm - 4.25"
Sight radius approx. 158.0 mm -
Weight
Weapon approx. 770 g - 1.65lbs
Magazine approx. 53 g

image
The P8 pistol from HK is the newest addition to the armed forces of Germany. Essentially a USP with the P8 designation provided by the German government, the P8 replaces the P1 (P38) in a number of units. The “backwards” safety lever was designed that way to facilitate the easy transition to the P8 from the P1. The P8 was first fielded in 1995 with 60 units going to German Navy divers, 195 went to KSK initially, then the first large scale order of 14,186 units to the Air Force, Navy and Bundeswehr depots. Then a follow on order for 20,720 more. In the years since, many thousands more P8 pistols have been fielded by the armed forces of Germany. The above example is one of the very first ones, with the frame mounted markings of S and F not yet visible. The Bundesadler (see symbols page) is present as is “Bw” (short for Bundeswehr), and it is marked over with a double X. Serial number on this gun is 028. The “white” 15 round magazine is standard issue with this pistol in Germany, both for armed forces and civilian sales. Very few white magazines ever made it into the U.S. before the ban in Oct. 1994. Capital City Firearms had the only ones that I knew about. I don’t know that there has been an increase of their importation with the passing of the ban. Seems not.


#49

HK also made one of the ugliest pistols :nauseated_face:


#50

I wouldn’t trade my HK-91 for anything out there.
Reliability and accuracy are unparalleled in a rifle of its type.
But it isn’t your AR by any means.
These are Battle Rifles not Assault Rifles as is popular today.
Now discontinued production from HK there are many clones out there of varying quality.

The new production HK rifles I see are attempts to cash in on the AR craze.
Although the testing by folks I see is favorable the cost is high.

I have looked at handguns they produce and I think that there are just as good or even better at lower prices on the market.
I may replace my carry gun (BDA 380) in the future and I will consider HK again, but I suspect I will go with another brand at a lower cost and more preferable design features.