Interesting article about HK.

4 Likes

Interesting, with as little as I know of it I have to wonder if it was an interference on our part, seems plausible we may have overstepped

2 Likes

@Robert

I think the USA has long had a history of interfering in other countries’ affairs. This is just yet another example of it. Of course, one thing the USA (government) seems to really like to base its decision to interfere on is whether it could negatively impact a communist government - and if so, the USA government seems delighted to interfere.

I hate true communism as much as anyone I know. But, China is not altogether communistic. They have been moving away from true communism for at least 20 years, probably longer. They have stock markets, private ownership of land and buildings, the right to vote (though there are some real limitations in the voting process), and various other things that are evidence of their trend(s) away from communism.

Still, what the USA has been doing in relation to HK lately is simply overstepping and agitative. Will Trump get his trade pact with China now that he has shown (undue) bias in favor of the protesters? From what I have been hearing, it does reduce the chances. Who will benefit if the trade pact doesn’t get done? Personally, I wish our government would stop putting obstacles in the way of getting the trade pact done and just get it done as soon as they can. Then, they can worry about other issues in China, et al.

And just to be clear, I am not advocating for China in any way. They still have issues with their form of government - enough so, that I don’t want to move there, ever. I still think the USA is the best place in the world to live.

2 Likes

I don’t think we overstepped on this one at all. Personally I don’t think we should even be trading with any communist or socialist state at all so this in my opinion didn’t go far enough.

Communism is wrong! I’m not just saying that because it sounds cool. It really really is a bunch of bull shit! I would be acting the same way these protesters were if communism was knocking on my door. I would support their violence towards the communist country all day long.

2 Likes

That’s not true at all. In China they still economically reward their citizens not based on work but on opinions and their ability to be subordinate to chinas leaders. They have total control of the media, no free speech. They control every aspect of their life’s.

There is no part of China you could ever say is reliant on freedom.

3 Likes

The citizens of China have made their choice.
They have the government of slave makers they deserve.
We should just stay out of it, along with all the other meddlesome stuff our state department has gotten us into.

2 Likes

LOL, would ya?

2 Likes

We’re not talking about the citizens of China. Hong Kong has very different history than that of China

3 Likes

@Joe

I am not aware of the economic rewards you speak of, but I agree, they probably are rewarded for being good citizens (by their government’s view), somehow. I do know that they have (at least in some places), adopted behavior scoring and that they punish the low scoring people by prohibiting their travel in some ways.

Regarding my comments - Chinese citizens have been granted property ownership rights that they never had before. As a result of that (and other things), many Chinese citizens have become rich (or, at least millionaires). Real estate in China is often very expensive, (though it is generally worse in HK).

Oh, I agree, China still has its communist ways. I surely hope the USA never becomes like China.

Still, China has made some progress in giving its citizens more freedom. And, that is what I am looking at, and that the changes they have made appear to be internally generated. So, we don’t need to meddle in their affairs - as long as they don’t meddle in ours.

Regarding the part of China that is reliant on freedom: the people that start businesses, is. They choose the business, where to start it, and what kind of business it will be.

2 Likes

If you can’t see the intrinsic harm in this system you are blind as a bat. DO you really think that CCP won’t deploy this paramilitary sociocommunist control grid where ever and when ever they can…REALLY!!! And you would be “OK” with this? You speak a different language than I do. THE MOST VALUABLE thing we have is our liberty and without it we are all nothing but slaves. I cannot in good conscience wish this upon any people and will continue to cheer on those that are fighting, resisting, and causing chaos for their right to be free people, AND TO STAY THAT WAY!

3 Likes

@preachp

Of course I see the harm in their behavior scoring system - that is why I hope we NEVER get that in the USA. I am not so “blind” as you think I am. The difference between you and me here seems to be two things: (1) I don’t want the USA to spend its limited resources trying to enforce its own ideologies on other countries - our government can’t even pay its own bills and we are taxed too much as is: and (2) the protesters in HK have brought HK down a lot and continue to bring it down. They will not (IMHO) win over the communist regime in Beijing, and thus all the lives they have taken and will take, as well as the bodily injuries they have caused, and the severe property damage and business disruption, have not helped at all, and will only threaten HK further. And our attempt at meddling in China/HK affairs (IMHO), has only made things worse. In the interim, those of us living in HK continue to suffer the consequences of the protesters and USA’s meddling. Nobody that lives in HK is benefitting!

1 Like