Low bore axis?


#1

Low bore axis? What is it? Well if you have ever met a hardcore CZ pistol enthusiast you most likely have heard it a time or two. That is exactly where I heard it. Now don’t get me wrong I love, and own an arm full of CZ pistols! Now let’s take this saying to the lab and do some measurements.


Here is the line up picked at random.

Here is the work space. I will be using a leveled Doall garnet surface plate 24”x18”
This plate was never abused and is still accurate to .0002 across 24”, and can be verified by a collimator.


I will be using 1,2,3 blocks to hold pistol in a level state. I will also be using gage pins to find true bore center.
So all pistols being measured will be chambered in 9mm Luger. I will measure the highest point in the grip (unless it is angled. Then the measurement will be the center of the beaver tail) to the top of the gage pin. The height will be added and 1/2 of the gage pin to get to true center of the bore.
(Remember when the dual beam height gage is moving in the downward motion the dial will spin “backwards”)

first up is the CZ85 combat! The gage is zeroed at the tail.
the top of the pin to the tail measures .949” the gage pin diameter is .348\2= .174”. .174+.949= 1.123” that is the distance from the top of the firing hand to the center of the bore! Ok let’s collect some more data on other pistols.
we will do one more CZ. Next up is the CZ 75 SP01 Tactical. Re zeroed the gage on the tail. this one measures .929”+.174”= 1.103” sweet even lower than the CZ85.
next is the PPQ m2. Gage zeroed.

This measures.825”. Now the gage pin had to change to a .345” due to the polygonal rifling. So .825+.1725”= .9975” wow nice!
next up Glock model 17. Gage is zeroed. this measures.613”+.1725”= .7855”.
Holy cow! I even measured this twice.
next up is the HK USP. Gage zeroed. this measures 1.230”+ .1725”= 1.4025” wow that’s a tall bore axis!
next is the Beretta 92s. A little harder to set up, but the sides on the slide are true and flat. The wood blocks steady the set up, and retains a level measurement. Gage zeroed. measurements are 1.040”+.174”= 1.214”. The gage pin is a .348” for this barrel.
next is a Sig 226 tac ops. Gage zeroed.
the measurement is 1.158”+.174= 1.332” pretty tall bore axis on the Sig.
now I got a little heat for a past test from my good friend @Mister_Torgue for not having a Star pistol in it, so Mister_Torgue this ones for you Brother!
We have a Star Super B!
again wood for balance. Thr measurement is 1.066”+.174”= 1.240”

Ok so we have
CZ85 1.123”
CZ75 SP01 1.103”
PPQ .9975”
Glock 17 .7855”
HK USP 1.4025”
Beretta 92s 1.214”
Sig 226 1.332”
Star Super B 1.240”

So what can this tell us? Well the CZ has a good low-ish bore axis, but the PPQ, and Glock 17 are lower!
I was shocked at the results personally.

Now why has the CZ pistols have a low bore axis been a “mic drop” saying in forums and at the range? Well let’s turn to historical evolution of handguns. In 1975 and moving forward I’m sure the CZ pistols certainly had the lowest bore axis, but once Gaston Glock showed up apparently he was going for a low bore axis as well.
I realize that there is a lot of other pistols that offer a low/lower bore axis on the market. The Strike one comes to mind.

The real question is what do you think?
What have your experience’s been?

I hope you had fun reading this, and I hope @Mel64D approves of the lab set up and equipment used for our measurements.

Thank you all for your time, and like always be safe and have fun!


#2

Very interesting. I’ll check back soon to help save you from the mob. :grin:


#3

Yeah. My internet was to check for myself. I was shocked to see the results!


#4

Nice thread. Got a Steyr or Caracal? Those look purty low to the eye.


#5

Yeah they do, and I wish I owned them too.


#6

interesting comparison and the difference that I see is in your baseline benchmark



#7

Well having that chart could have saved me some time this morning, but it wouldn’t have been as fun either.


#8

Does the CZ P10/P07 have the same bore heigth as the CZ 85?


#9

The P10c and p07 are different. I can check how different.


#10

My bad, I thought the p10 was just the striker version of the p07.


#11

Yeah they are different, but a comparison would be interesting. I can do one later.


#12

Given your superior intellect I feel compelled to change your screen name to…




Joe Bauers.






while the test of us just watch







#13

:joy: thank you @Robert. Although I feel compelled to tell you I once watered my lawn with energy drinks… I thought it was craving electrolytes… it died soon after.


#14

But…


#15

Well, @switchpod, you done did it, now. Those CZ guys are gonna show up with pitchforks and torches at your doorstep (Seriously, those guys are nuts and won’t take this well). With any luck, they’ll reject your elaborate, scientific test and go back to searching for those elusive “1 of 100” models (that were never imported) they keep bugging me to find (That’s a regular occurrence, by the way).

Me? I’m still waiting to see that CZ “Glock killer” I keep hearing so much about. :rofl:

All jokes aside, very nicely done. That’s an impressive amount of work you put in there. :+1::+1::+1:


#16

I hear this phrase alot. Look at all these Glock killers that couldnt kill Glock.
CZ p07 /p10
FNS / FN 509
S&W M&P
Sig p320
HK VP9
Beretta APX
Etc etc


#17


Hi bore axis point


#18


#19

Thats an uber tactical hi point.


#20

Still a turd