I understand what you are saying and have read a lot of the same. The wife and I have handguns in the room and we have decided that if something goes bump in the night we will shelter in place and shoot only as a last resort. I love my house and things in it but nothing in there cant be replaced. Now the shotgun is on my side of the bed and she has her little P22. If all that doesn’t work then I reach for the 357. Hopefully I will never need it.
I keep a 870 tactical with no 4 buck. Also a 20 gauge side by side with no 6 shot.
Run BB or #6 shot… #7 is to light unless you are at 5 feet. #6 is still way small. BB is the best if you are worried about over penetration because you have a better chance of penetrating deep enough to hit vital parts but not enough to over penetrate walls etc. Very effective to 25 feet. But after that the threat is still in the fight unless you get head shot and blind the bastards.
Being a crazy artist… I decided that a Pirate / Diablo theme was needed. It catches the eye of clients. That’s the main point of it. My personal shotguns that I would use for home defense are more woods camo or… less flashy.
I had a SPAS but that damn thing was heavy… ended up selling it and buying Benelli instead. Hahahha
As I stated up top don’t trust any bird shot with your life. Stuff is too inconsistent as a fight stopper. Same goes for .22lr- with all the real world I’ve seen and real reports I’ve read it’s hit or miss for ending a confrontation. And more times than not is a miss.
My three things I would not trust in a gun fight because of what I have first hand or reading first hand (usually administered under penalty of perjury) reports on are .22 lr, shotguns loaded with bird shot or anecdote from combat M855 (62 grain “Green Tip” ball) ammo. Last one is very personal and anecdotal experience- I know others and what a lot of military reports say contradicts me there, but I don’t trust it.
I’m fan of the 870 over the m500/590. That said, I’d take either into a fight… especially over a double barrel. The new 13” and 14” barreled “firearms”, such as the Shockwave, are exceptional weapons. I spent a LOT of time on a Shockwave, and by the end of the day I was hitting 100% of the clays.
I shoot a LOT of shotgun and prefer it for most of my LE work. It is a great finisher to a shooting… don’t get me wrong though, I’d NEVER choose one to get into a “gunfight”.
I like using low recoil, 00 buck. It’s a personal preference and I have a LOT of experience with it. 4Buck (.24cal) is a great load and still packs a lethal punch. The BB loads are only .18 caliber and won’t carry enough weight for a lethal penetration. If that’s your endgame, then feel comfortable with that. If I get into a shooting, I only plan on one side of the story ever being told.
Braced they are just about perfect. Though KelTecs newest shotgun looks like it has serious potential.
Protecting our family for 4 generations.
Hold the trigger and pump. KISS
While I agree… I disagree.
The guy I was responding to uses #7… while at point blank it is better than nothing, like I stated earlier I would not use it. Smallest I would personally use is BB but I understand some people are very afraid of the possibility of a shot going through layers of sheetrock or what ever… and hitting a innocent person, or pet, or fill in the blank.
I love slugs and buck shot myself, but there are a lot of people out there that think and see reports of shootings with bird shot that is pretty much ineffective. Most of these are at 25 plus yards.
While I have worked on some really large homes, most homes do not have more than a 10 yard range and even that is relatively rare. I would really like to see a report of actual distance that firearms are used inside a home for defense.
Anyone have that information?
I have played a lot with shotguns and lots of different loads. I personally would feel confident with a 2 3/4 load in BB if inside the average American home. But again, not the best choice. I think cost, recoil, and the amount of penetration that slugs of any kind or 00, 000, or #4 buck offer scare a lot of “family” protection scenarios away from it.
I personally really like mini shells in a pump and having them staggered. Slugs and 00 Buck… even when I had children in my home. I stagger now in my pistol and in my rifle. M855 ammo staggered with HPBT and V-Max
I personally find there is no magic type of projectile or caliber.
BB shot at point blank out to 20 feet works better (never have seen BB in s low brass shell) than #7 or #6 and if someone is going to insist on using shot, BB is the only other choice they really have.
Now I really am not trying to advocate the use of bird shot! So please do not jump on me about that. I just have read so many people denouncing the use of any type of birdshot and using tests that are from 25 yards or 100… then claiming that all birdshot sucks and should never be used. At 6 to 15 feet, there is no F-ing way I want to be shot with #8 let alone with a pellet gun… or anything else for that matter.
Depends on the choke you have too. A full choke at 6 to 15 yards is about like a slug I don’t care what shot size.
I think a lot of people misperceive what a shotgun spread actually is. So many people are worried about what the spread and the additional shot missing and hitting something important. Granted that is a legitimate fear… It’s not a very realistic one. A standard full choke, at 25 yards, has a 25 inch spread… how many people here actually have 25 yards of distance inside their houses? A realistic number is only 3 to 5 yards, and 7 to 10 yards for some longer hallways.
I’ve measured out my house, and I would only have 12” patterns at the two furthest points of my house… and that would require me to be backed against a wall, and the perp to be backed against the opposite wall… also not realistic. 99% of my room to doorway engagements are only about 10’.
Low recoil buckshot will guarantee a bit more control of your shotgun. I’ll bet my paycheck that a perp won’t tell you he noticed a difference of 00 buck at 1400fps vs 1600fps. Especially at short range.
Flight control load (reduced spread) is an option, as I’m getting about 15” spread at 25 yards. Still not worth it to me for a HD weapon. If you only have a 10 inch spread at your furthest engagement indoors, do you really see the benefit of reducing that to about 6 inches? Especially when a realistic spread is normally closer to about 5 to 6 inches, thus making your “controlled” spread only 3 to 4 inches.
^ This is great stuff @Robocop1051. It was along my line of thinking as well.
OK so I am the original poster. Thanks for all the input. I still have made my decision to run #7 birdshot. I am less scared of the spread and a miss of a few pellets as I am a miss period. Targets move. Its not like we are talking about the range and a static target. I would love to say I never miss but I am human and am not infallible so missed shot getting into the next room with enough power scares me.
I measured my shots in my house. Longest one is 10 feet in the 3 bedrooms and 15 feet down the hall to the kitchen. Every video I have seen at hose ranges show 4 in or better penetration at that distance with #7. I know that’s not whats recommended but I bet the perp if hit with that at that distance will at least think twice of his/her forward motion. Especially when they hear the second round racked in the chamber.
Again I do appreciate the input as it has given me food for thought. I have just made the decision that makes the best since for me.
just one more caveat. What ever you choose to load, stick with it don’t mix up your loading because I assure you Murphy is a monster! What ever load you don’t need will be there, or you’ll forget what is what.
We have a guy who insisted on Loading his duty SG with Slug 00 Slug 00 Slug. He had all the reasons in the book for it (won’t bore you). Gets an injured bear call. Car Bear accident. Bear has dragged itself into chest high grass. He gets out of the car pumps one into the chamber loads two more slugs into the tube. Goes in, bear rears up 15-18’ (not yards) from him. He blasts it in the face. Drops it right there. Walks up pokes it with the SG. It lunges for him almost takes the gun out of his hands but he blasts it point blank in the chest. Then empties the SG for good measure. After a change of pants (him) and a necropsy (bear) later. Find out the first round was 00. 9 pellets NOT ONE penetrated the skull. Lucky for him the bear had broke both legs and it’s pelvis in the accident so was not mobile. He couldn’t remember if he always had it loaded 00 Slug 00 Slug or if he dispatched something else and didn’t replace the Slug. He never carried Buck again.
Yep. No replacement for going out and finding out for your self what a particular round will do in a particular shotgun. We built a large target holder to pattern our SG’s.
Now we know what works best for our individual weapons.