The merits of the caliber debate with modern ammunition


#87

Yeahhh a subcompact would be hard for me too.


#88

The Sig p320 compact is the size of a Glock 19, in .45 acp and you get 9+1 rounds. The standard mags are 10 rounds and there is supposedly going to be 12 rounders soon.


#89

They only run $480 and the trigger is super smooth.


#90

Federal does some lightweight rounds:

https://www.federalpremium.com/products/handgun/premium-personal-defense/personal-defense-hydrashok/p40hs2

https://www.federalpremium.com/products/handgun/premium-personal-defense/personal-defense-hydrashok-low-recoil/pd40hs4-h

I prefer 165 for most applications though, and Federal, Hornady, and Sig all do good 165 loads.


#91

The gun, caliber and choice of weapon is the least of it.
It’s all about the person behind the gun that counts.


#93

This discussion has been very pleasant and thoughtful, kinda like Full30 was intended to be. Not really a decisive answer, but many personal skills and training contribute to the discussion. Personally, I try to avoid being shot by anything. thank you, gentlemen


#94

Move to va brother
Let’s network


#95

I like that, well said…
There are a few things though to consider also. Where you live.
People will look at me funny when I say this…
Here in Montana we have big bears. Same in Alaska… while a handgun is mainly for people defense… we do have to use them for other defense as well.
As for capacity, oh there is that too. I carry a 40 Sig P229 with a 14 round mag with one in the chamber. If I am not carrying that, I have a Glock G20 Gen 4 with a 17 round mag and one in the chamber.
I advise people to carry a firearm they can actually hit something with. Then go shoot it… A LOT. Hahhaha
Another thing I advise people on is what is the weather. In the winter when it is -30¬į F you will be up against an attacker who will most likely be wearing many layers of clothing with lots of insulation.
I personally believe that no matter what the caliber chosen, to use the middle ground weight and make it go fast as possible as long as your weapon can handle it. My 10mm usually swallows 155 grain bonded core HPs traveling at 1500 feet per second. For my 40 I like 155 grain or 135 grain. Loaded hot.
9mm I like 115 grain +P+
At the end of the day though for me at least… my side arm is there to get me to my rifle.
:grin:
With an 80% chance of living after being shot with a handgun, I like the rifle better. 80% chance of them dying. If I am shooting, I want them stopped. Dead is a really good way of stopping someone. If we are robbed at the shop, they are not after the free candy we give out. So dropping and stopping the threat as fast as possible is the ultimate goal. Just not many people have the ability to have a rifle to protect themselves.


#96

Many years ago I killed quite a few Deer with a Mini14 and 55 grain FMJ ammo…those bullets would blow up like a HP creating nasty wounds…you never know what a bullet will do when it hits something…putting lead on target is the only way to stop a life or death situation…as much lead as possible…on whatever part you can hit…regardless of caliber…


#97

Have to agree, but that would lead people to think just because they have 20 rounds of 22 LR they are better off than 7 rounds of 9mm
So there is a sweet spot in all this debate.
At least that’s my way of thinking. I would much rather have a 10mm to go up against a bear for instance. But I would much rather have a 9mm than a 45 for a bear gun (with the right rounds of course)
There are so many factors to a daily carry that there is no one right answer. This is why we have so many calibers and designs to chose from.
Personally I just want people to carry. Something! Pepper spray in hand is better than a handful of Hope’s and dreams. If I could, I would drive around in an armored vehicle with belt fed weapons and a team… just not very practical and I do not have that much money. :grin:


#98

I would take .45 acp over 9mm for a bear. .45 super ,to be specific. Neither is anywhere clse to ideal.


#99

Bear muscle is 10 times denser than a human athlete’s. You need maximum penetration… Q the music


#100

It is denser and .45 provides more energy than 9mm, especially. 45 super. Niether is adequete though, .44 mag is probably the lowest I would choose to go.


#102

I would not go up against a bear with a 45 acp… Super? Maybe… I have stood next to a 600 pound grizzly who was sitting on his butt. Then he stood up. Yeah…
I pack a 10mm with penatraters


#103

I stagger my rounds usually for penetration issues. Fmj/hp


#104

I would not either, I said I would take it over 9mm against a bear. 10mm is better than either.
If shooting Grizzley bear is the game then I would avoid handguns all together unless its the .500 magnum, ymmv.

For me its:
.45 acp for people defense
10mm for woods carry
.44 mag or bigger if brown bear are a worry.


#105

Uh huh uh huh you said penetration issues


#106

:joy:


#107

Ive only used .45 super in two different guns that I bought that were built for it. There are ways to convert it back and forth depending on the manf. , I dont know of any 1911s that shoot super though. The HK USP is what ive shot super out of mostly.
I like 10mm a little more than .45 super.


#108

This conversation is going places.